Oh excellent Frank. How is it relevant? If someone produces a report that is full off holes, inconsistencies and unanswered questions, there can only be two possible reasons. The first is that such a person is very stupid and should not have been picked for the job or two that person was picked intentionnaly in order to help cover something up. What ever that something is, we need to know about it. It may be benign or it may be sinister, but we won't know that will we.
As for the hijackers, look it up. If you know of an official explanation anywhere that can prove that all 19 hijackers were actual people living prior to 911 and are now all dead, lead the way.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 14:46
Now replying to 241. I'll try to make it simple for you. I am not asking you or anyone else for that matter, to prove or disprove anything. What I am asking is that you pay attention to the fact that the official report is inadequate and leaves a lot of unaswered questions, some of which were outlined in 232.
WE ourselves can't prove or disprove anything because we don't have the power or the means to ask the right people. However, collectively as people who are supposed to live in a free country should have the right to know the truth.
What you seem to be saying is that everything is explained and there is nothing further to add so we should all shut up and move on. Well you move on if you want to.
As for the Pentagon question, it was rhetorical, I'm hoping that you know what that means.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 14:32
Chip, sorry, did I wake you again. You seem to drift in and out. You seem a lot happier asleep.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 14:19
Sorry I was busy replying to 238 before seeing 239. Your comments make me smile. Jibberish you say. This implies that you actually trust the people in congress and the president? You have no reservations about any of the insane laws and wars and perpetual degredation of liberties they have imposed both before and since 911?
If this is true, you are not asleep but positively comatosed.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 14:17
There are many websites and some even official one's which would give you the names of the suspects still alive. The fact is that even if ONE of them is still alive, the whole thing becomes a farce. There are also many unofficial sites who provide listings. You have access to the same sources as I have so google it an look.
As for what is so secretive about the plane hitting the Pentagon, you have already satisfactorily answered it by saying you don't know in your post 235. But aren't your asking the wrong person? If there is nothing secretive about it, let us go to the nice people of the FBI and kindly ask them to hand over the videos they confisgated. We wouldn't need to ask then, would we.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 14:06
Thanks to Chip also for giving us an insight into exploitation by charlatans. Thank goodness for our leaders who are nothing of the sort.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 13:53
Gentle reminder that only those who think they've lost the argument resort to insults.
However, let me continue to humour you by saying that since you've satisfied yourself of having explained ONE of the things on the list, you now have about TWELVE to go plus all the others I've not even mentioned. Good luck.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 13:47
At best, the arguments about how or why the buildings fell are contentious. That is why an independent commission is required. However, much like the recent documentaries, you and many others insist on leaving out the things that cannot possibly be explained by mere observation of the events.
What about the coincidental exercises?
What about the insurance taken out on the buildings?
What about the 11-fold increase in put options leading up to the day relating to airline companies involved?
What about Bush's brother being in charge of security until the final day when the contract ended?
Where is the plane parts from the plane hitting the Pentagon or the one that crashed?
Why was all the steel from the towers shipped off to China without the chance for forensic examination?
Why can't we see the videos of the plane hitting the Pentagon?
Why were all such videos confisgated by the FBI and still not released?
What about the explosions heard by many witnesses inside the towers before they fell?
What can possibly be so secretive about a plane hitting the Pentagon?
Why was Bin Laden's plane allowed to fly during the no fly restrictions following 911 when nobody else could?
Why would anyone calling his mother by mobile phone from the stricken plane introduce himself as "Mark Bingham"?
Why are at least 6 of the hijackers still known to be alive and well?
The list goes on and on and none of it is either addressed or adequately explained by the official report. Considering the nature of the attack and the horrific impact it has had on many people, not least of all those directly involved, I think it deserves a little more than us picking holes in each other's arguments on a blog. The official report leaves a very great deal to be desired and I don't know of many people who deny even that.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 13:35
Let's approach this from another point of view. Fire can weaken steel. This is true. But can it weaken it sufficiently to cause two 100+ storey buildings to collapse in 10 seconds? I don't see why one has to be an expert engineer to see the obvious flaw in this argument not to mentions that it is completely unprecedented. But let us say for the sake of argument that the twin towers fell directly as a result of the planes hitting them.
Why did building 7 fall in much the same way? Why did Silvertein say on television that the decision was made to "pull it"? How can you pull a building of that size in that situation, in such a short time? What does he mean by, "pull it"? If they did pull it, who did it? I haven't heard of any one who was on site say "yes it was us, we pulled it". Please enlighten me. Who pulled building 7? If it wasn't pulled, why did Silvertein say it was?
It really doesn't need a lot of expertise to realise the absurdity of it all. What kind of a coincidence is it to run exercises with the exact same situation being played out at exactly the same time? What kind of a coincidence is it that Silverstein owns all three buildings? What kind of a coincidence is it that he takes out insurance shortly before the event for exactly the sort of attack we all witnessed?
The point I'm trying to make is that we are not talking about just one or two anomalies here. We are saying there is a whole raft of unaswered questions which nobody at government level seems to be bothered by? I would be more than happy if all the issues are investigated by independent people who are given the freedom to ask whoever, whatever is necessary to get at the truth. The very fact that this has absolutely no chance of happening should bring home to the deniers that at the very least, something is amiss. We ask nothing more than the right to know. That's all.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 12:52
Thank you Frank and Rick. Very nice of you to reply. Frank had taken the trouble to count the number of "wake ups" and Rick has trouble understanding English.
Let's try again. I did not say that past ills are proof for present tragedies. What I was trying to convey is that it takes a long time for the truth to spread to the majority. Did everyone realise what was going on when Hitler was doing what he was doing? No, of course they didn't. Did everyone rise up in arms when Stalin was doing what he was doing? No they didn't. But now, with the luxury of hindsight, who would argue that some of those things were possibly the worst in our miserable history of human politics.
People who keep having a go at the so called "truthers" do it for the following set of logical reasons.
Fact 1. 911 was a deliberate act. (No one denies this)
Fact 2. Whoever did this is considered to be evil and thinks nothing of murdering innocent people and causing misery and mayhem.
Route 1: The goverment did. If this is the case, tradegy for all of us because it means government leaders are evil and despicable and therefore we're all doomed.
Route 2. Terrorists did it. Tradegy for those who died and their families. But for those who reject route 1, what a relief, our government is ok after all.
Can it get any simpler than that.Comment Posted By ghosttown On 24.08.2007 @ 12:16